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  • I asked Artificial Intelligence (AI) who the best hernia surgeons were

    Posted by PeterC on April 20, 2023 at 1:02 pm

    Hey everyone, I’m posting this here in case it helps any of you that are still looking for answers with your specific situations or maybe looking for more opinions. With the recent rise in popularity and heavy development AI systems have seen I figured I might as well take advantage and see what it says. The doctors are NOT in order of “best to worse” its just numbered 1,2,3,4 to separate each entry.

    I first asked a leading Artificial Intelligence program to tell me who were some of the leading experts when it comes to hernia complications. These were the names it gave me (copy-pasted).

    1. Dr. Robert J. Fitzgibbons Jr. – He is a Professor of Surgery at Creighton University and is known for his expertise in hernia surgery and complex hernia repairs.

    2. Dr. Andrew Kingsnorth – He is a consultant surgeon at Plymouth Hospitals NHS Trust in the UK and has been involved in the development of several international guidelines on hernia surgery.

    3. Dr. Guy Voeller – He is a Professor of Surgery at the University of Tennessee Medical Center and has extensive experience in the management of complicated hernias.

    4. Dr. B. Todd Heniford – He is the Chief of Gastrointestinal and Minimally Invasive Surgery at Carolinas Medical Center in the US and is known for his expertise in the management of complex hernias and abdominal wall reconstruction.

    I then asked AI who the leading experts are specifically when it comes to tissue-based hernia repairs. I think AI understood tissue as in biological mesh – nevertheless I’m posting the answers it gave me.

    1. Dr. Yuri Novitsky – He is a Professor of Surgery at the University of California, San Francisco (UCSF) and is known for his expertise in tissue-based hernia repairs. He has developed several techniques for repairing hernias using biological materials, such as porcine dermis or human acellular dermal matrix.

    2. Dr. Robert J. Fitzgibbons Jr. – He is a Professor of Surgery at Creighton University and is a leading expert in hernia surgery and complex hernia repairs. He has extensive experience in tissue-based hernia repairs and has published several articles on the subject.

    3. Dr. William Cobb – He is a Professor of Surgery at the University of Texas Southwestern Medical Center and has a special interest in hernia surgery and tissue-based hernia repairs. He has developed several techniques for repairing hernias using biologic materials and has trained many surgeons in his techniques.

    4. Dr. Michael Rosen – He is a Professor of Surgery at the Cleveland Clinic and is known for his expertise in tissue-based hernia repairs. He has published numerous articles on the subject and has developed several innovative techniques for repairing hernias using biological materials.

    Finally I asked AI to point me towards leading experts when it comes to hernia repairs without the use of mesh.

    1. Dr. William Brown – He is a general surgeon based in California, USA, and is known for his expertise in repairing hernias without using mesh. He has developed his own technique called the Shouldice method, which uses sutures to reinforce the weakened abdominal wall.

    2. Dr. Robert Bendavid – He is a Professor of Surgery at the University of Toronto, Canada, and is known for his expertise in tissue-based hernia repairs and repairs without mesh. He has developed several techniques for repairing hernias using biological materials and sutures.

    3. Dr. Guy Voeller – He is a Professor of Surgery at the University of Tennessee Medical Center and has extensive experience in the management of complicated hernias. He is known for his expertise in repairing hernias without using mesh.

    4. Dr. Kang Kim – He is a general surgeon based in New York, USA, and is known for his expertise in hernia repairs without mesh. He has developed his own technique called the Kim technique, which uses sutures and biologic materials to repair hernias.

    Obviously take these with a grain of salt, its an AI system basing its results on available data rather than word of mouth/patient feedback but I still thought it to be interesting since I hadn’t heard of some of these people at all. I also asked it about sports hernias for myself and it came up with a few names that I had never heard of before that I’ll look into.

    Cheers

    • This discussion was modified 1 year, 8 months ago by  PeterC.
    pinto replied 1 year, 8 months ago 4 Members · 5 Replies
  • 5 Replies
  • pinto

    Member
    April 20, 2023 at 7:56 pm

    @PeterC, wasn’t the description about Dr. Brown highly inaccurate? I don’t believe he would be technically called a “general surgeon.” More importantly it is patently false that “He has developed his own technique called the Shouldice method.” How is it that AI would mangle such basic information?

    If you don’t mind, how did you feel when AI produced his name? Isn’t he the same Dr. Brown who was your surgeon, who you attribute producing your tragic results?

  • Mike M

    Member
    April 20, 2023 at 7:54 pm

    Corrections: Sizes (not side stupid autocorrect) and Dr. Edward L. Felix, MD and *NOT* Dr. Voeller. Not sure how youtube sent me to the wrong interview* https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbgzMlPQcuU

  • Mike M

    Member
    April 20, 2023 at 7:43 pm

    Pardon my ignorance but is the AI also making a mistake regarding Dr. Kang Kim ? This should be Dr. Kang in South Korea I would suspect?

    I started to research some of those names after Dr. Towfigh’s corrections peaked my interest. I watched some of her youtube sessions with a few of the surgeons mentioned.

    Dr. Voeller seems very accomplished but I got the feeling he is “compromised” when it comes to being open minded about possible solutions to hernia repair that did not involve the mesh industry. I feel like he is stuck in the late 1980s when mesh might have been a breakthrough discovery?

    Dr. Michael Rosen with Dr. Towfigh youtube interview was impressive. A lot of back and forth and very reasonable open minded dialog in regards to the different types of hernia repairs and their applications. All of the feedback, open discussion, etc. was very insightful and genuine. Dr Towfigh makes a very striking point whereas if you have a hernia the sides of the width of her shoulders is mesh still not a solution?

    Not that it matters but I really have a respect for both of those doctors after watching that interview.

  • pinto

    Member
    April 20, 2023 at 7:28 pm

    @PeterC, what could be an interesting venture turns out contradictory because your (1) thread title (purpose) conflicts with (2) the instruction given the AI:

    (1) I asked Artificial Intelligence (AI) who the best hernia surgeons were
    (2) I first asked a leading Artificial Intelligence program to tell me who were some of the leading experts when it comes to hernia complications.

    I don’t think (2) is the same as (1). (2) may reap candidates more scholarly inclined than surgically. (2) may be most productive in producing research reports or conceptual pieces than actual surgical skill. Thus the AI chose at least one deceased member and some already retired ones. Thank you for your attempt, but unfortunately, therefore, these AI results cannot help but hinder patient choice of surgeons.

    You need to ask the AI what the criteria are for choosing the “best.” Those criteria might not be applicable for today’s patients choosing surgeons.

    Finally, why not just name the AI rather than not disclosing it? It may or may not be “leading” for the purpose intended while concealing purview of its algorithm.

    • This reply was modified 1 year, 8 months ago by  pinto.
  • drtowfigh

    Moderator
    April 20, 2023 at 2:11 pm

    fascinating.

    Some corrections:
    – Drs. Brown & Kingsnorth are retired
    – Dr. Bendavid has passed
    – Dr. Novitsky is in New York
    – Dr. Cobb is in South Carolina
    – Dr. Voeller is in Memphis and not part of UT
    – I am not familiar with Dr. Kang Kim

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