[ajm222]

Thanks for sharing your story! That’s very interesting. I also notice no real difference in terms of pain with exercise. Though lately it seems I notice the tightness and discomfort more when exercising. I am hoping Dr. Procter can help me make a final decision. I have great faith in Dr. Belyansky’s renowned abilities, and Dr. Procter had also told me that even with removals he has done himself it’s very rare to see someone worse off. This was kind of surprising, but I think he was referring to removals done by experienced hernia surgeons who regularly do them. I did have regular pain up to about a year and a half after surgery, and that always concerned me. And I’d love to be able to get back to exercising without noticing this tightness so heavily. I also feel like I carry myself differently now, which may have something to do with my recent sciatica issues. I kind of want him to get in there and see if he can tell what’s bothering me. He seemed to be very interested in the investigation part of the surgery and really trying to determine the source of a person’s issues.

Anyway, I do wonder if in another 6 months or a year I would get to a place where maybe I just got past this and stopped noticing it, as apparently it’s kind of unusual, and could very well be related to being ultra-sensitive. I’ve toyed with the idea it’s entirely psychosomatic. I did have some weird period during a week over the summer on vacation where I could have sworn I was fine. I was walking/standing at Disney most of the time and not exercising, and I remember being super worried about a hernia developing on the other side, so was super focused on that. And wouldn’t you know I had quite a bit of pain on that side, at least for several days. But it went away and no hernia developed. Never been sure if the distraction ‘cured’ me temporarily, or if it was still there but I wasn’t aggravating it by doing the stuff I normally do which I don’t want to really avoid or can’t avoid (like sitting at a desk most of the day, and regular exercise). But Dr. B. seemed to suggest that wherever I am at now, it’s likely just going to stay that way. I worry I am rushing into things, but I think 2 years is also quite a while. And I worry about future issues related to what’s going on. Probably shouldn’t be thinking that way as I used to believe that over time things would only get better. But I’ve read about a number of people that had some minor issues at first and then things actually got a lot worse several years down the road. I also sort of like the idea of taking 2 weeks off work and just going into surgery and coming out a couple hours later being done with all the mesh worries and sitting back and healing. But as you say, there are certainly risks.

Sigh. Stay tuned.

[ajm222]

First post said unapproved. Apologies if this and the other end up both posting.

Plan is simply to remove the mesh robotically and not do anything else. No more mesh as he seems to think the size and 3D nature of the mesh and my body have resulted in a foreign body sensation and discomfort that would be better with no mesh going forward. It was interesting that he said if he had treated me in the first place that I might have been a candidate for pure tissue repair in the first place due to my age and activity levels and fitness (43, so not young but not quite old, and 5’7” and 160 lbs. but look a lot thinner than that – I seem to be very dense). I believe typically in these cases he finds no hernia present after removal, due to what I think he called a ‘scar plate’ or something along those lines. I think he would do some sort of tissue repair or reinforcement if he had any significant concerns about recurrence or weakness. I’m trusting his judgement on this. He said there is a chance he might need to leave some mesh in if there were entrapped structures that were too dangerous to risk damaging, and I don’t seem to be having any allergic or auto-immune issues related to the mesh itself so that would be fine. No plan to cut major nerves as I have no real neuropathic pain.

[ajm222]

quote drtowfigh:

Sounds good. What is the surgical plan ?

Thanks. Plan discussed with me was simply to remove the mesh robotically and likely not do anything else. He said no more mesh would be used since I was having issues. Would potentially only leave some mesh behind if there were entrapped nerves, cords, blood vessels etc. that he thought would be dangerous to damage. I’m not having any weird reactions to the mesh so no concerns if he can’t get it all out – mainly just said that my problem seemed to be the size and 3D nature of the mesh was resulting in a foreign body sensation and discomfort, and that should mostly go away if most of the mesh is removed. It’s my understanding that most of the time there is no hernia present when he removes the mesh, as a ‘scar plate’ or something like that tends to cover the area sufficiently. I believe if there were issues present that worried him regarding recurrence or weakness he would do some sort of tissue repair or reinforcement. He did not think there would be any need to cut any nerves of any kind intentionally as I’m not having any neuropathic pain.

[ajm222]

quote sean82:

its was actually a double inguinal hernia on both sides, didnt even know i had the 2nd one at all until i was told by the specialist,, i always have to put pressure on the area when going to the bathroom, the discomfort has always been from the right side , it has actually calmed a little since the 1st post had an ice pack on for a bit ….. i’ve read people usually tend to have a 2nd operation at some stage which this type ?!! is that often the cause ?

are you saying you’ve had to put pressure on the area every single time you have to use the bathroom, for 10 years, or just since this flare up?

[ajm222]

quote sean82:

its was actually a double inguinal hernia on both sides, didnt even know i had the 2nd one at all until i was told by the specialist,, i always have to put pressure on the area when going to the bathroom, the discomfort has always been from the right side , it has actually calmed a little since the 1st post had an ice pack on for a bit ….. i’ve read people usually tend to have a 2nd operation at some stage which this type ?!! is that often the cause ?

Are you saying that for 10 years you’ve had to apply pressure to the area every time you go to the bathroom? That seems entirely unacceptable to me.

[ajm222]

quote DrBrown:

[USER=”2051″]ajm222[/USER]
Dear AJM
Dr. Belyansky is an excellent surgeon. Since he has evaluated you and has advised an operation he must believe that he can make you better.
If I were you I would lean toward having the operation. This is the time of year for miracles.
Merry Christmas.
Bill Brown MD

thank you! same to you!

[ajm222]

quote DrBrown:

[USER=”2051″]ajm222[/USER]
Dear AJM
Removal of the mesh is a major operation. Not everyone is better after surgery.
If you live in S California, I would advise you to see Dr. Twofigh to fully understand your options.
Regards.
Bill Brown MD

Thanks again, Dr. Brown. I actually live about 2 1/2 hours from Dr. Belyansky and he’s already seen me twice and approved a removal surgery (robotic lap, which is the same way the mesh was originally placed), which I tentatively scheduled for late February, because of foreign body sensation. But just can’t decide if I will do it. No significant pain at this time (aside from occasional mild soreness, but clearly some tightness and pulling in my lower abdomen, hip area and testicle and just feeling off on my right side ever since a couple of months after surgery (to the point I had ultrasound, CT Scan and several doc appointments).

And the mild to moderate soreness lasted regularly for a year and a half. Just not sure I want this to be the best it can get for the remainder of my days, when everyone says it probably won’t get any better at this point. But also not thrilled with the idea of a few more holes in my abdomen and weeks and months of more recovery with a small risk of serious complications. But I’ve been uncomfortable for so long at this point, the recovery doesn’t concern me quite as much as some of the other aspects of another major abdominal surgery. Will give it another month or two and continue to mull this over.

[ajm222]

quote Good intentions:

I just posted something about Dr. Billing, linked below. There is probably more detail in some of my other posts also.

Dr. Kang is known for non-mesh hernia repair, but I think that he will remove mesh also. But, a laparoscopic removal might be best for you, considering how much area has probably been covered by the mesh in your original surgery.

I just got back from a vigorous trail hike and barely thought about the old mesh problems. One left over effect though is that my abdominal wall is still thicker and stiffer than it had been before surgery. I still often have to leave the top button undone on my pants.

It has barely been four months for you. It will probably be difficult to get your insurance company to pay for removal without having to go through months of “pain management” beforehand.

Good luck. [USER=”3098″]deeoeraclea[/USER]

https://www.herniatalk.com/12176-one-year-seven-months-since-mesh-removal

this issue you have here with your abdominal wall and needing to leave the top button undone – was that something that was an issue before removal as well?

[ajm222]

quote Meshpain:

In all honesty, the pain was much less than the original surgery. I was extremely nervous going in to have the mesh removed; worried that the pain would be as bad as the original surgery or worse but that was not the case. Some examples:

• It was almost two months after the mesh was installed before I could go a day without an opioid. When the mesh was removed, I was off them within a week.
• When the mesh was installed, it was 3 weeks before I could even walk a few blocks. When the mesh was removed, I was walking a mile within 5 days.
• I had tremendous shoulder pain from the gas after the initial surgery, of which I had none after the mesh removal surgery (I attribute this to surgical style differences).

Plus in general the pain from the second surgery was different/better because it was one that I could heal from. This was not the case with the original surgery because my body was not accepting the mesh and therefore couldn’t heal.

It’s a big decision with unknown outcomes, but I have no regrets having been through the procedure with Dr. Belyansky.
Let me know if I can be of any further help.

Thanks again! I guess our initial experiences were quite different. I only had moderate soreness after my initial surgery that’s I think typical for that kind of repair. None of the major pain or disability that it sounds like you had. But it sounds like the removal was maybe similar to my initial surgical experience.

[ajm222]

quote Arkj93:

I should add that I did NOT have any hernia repair of any kind performed after the mesh removal. Dr. Belyansky said he did not see a hernia there so he opted to leave it. He did say there is a small risk of re-herniating (about 4%) but I was willing to take that risk in order to be mesh free. This Friday will be 4 weeks post op for me and I’m feeling really good. At around the six week mark I am probably going to start exercising again. There are still some minor pains but each day is better than the last!

i would have to think 4% is amazing considering the liklihood of reherniating even with a properly done mesh repair is probably the same or greater.

[ajm222]

by the way, would you say the pain of the removal surgery was much greater than the original surgery?

[ajm222]

quote drtowfigh:

It may just be a tight repair since the scar tissue and the mesh itself shrank a bit. I recommend time. If it’s very very uncomfortable, then mesh redo. I have been using the hybrid Ovitex mesh in these cases where the mesh inflammation and stiffness is an issue.

ever do a redo or removal for someone who isn’t in pain per se but just a bit uncomfortable because of a constant feeling of tightness and pulling and/or foreign body sensation? considering removal because of almost 2 years of mild to moderate pain and tightness, but now that the pain has mostly subsided in the last couple of months i’m really torn. don’t love the idea of this unnatural feeling for the remainder of my days (i’m in my early 40’s), and worried about how long the pain initially lasted, but also know that removal is a big deal.

[ajm222]

thanks! this is all very helpful info. i’m going to continue to consider things and try and make some sort of decision in the next two months or so. and see if maybe things improve even further for me in that time.

[ajm222]

i don’t have a good answer for you, but only recently did most of the pain i was experiencing resolve. i am now approaching two years since my surgery and stopped having moderate pain and soreness just in the last month or two. any lingering pain is very mild if at all. my main issues now are the foreign body sensations and tightness and pressure and just overall feeling like the right side of my body is off compared to the left. maybe some slight pulling as well. and that hasn’t changed since a few months after surgery. so i am still trying to decide whether to have dr. belyansky remove the mesh. but i do think it’s possible for pain to go away long after surgery. sometimes there are psychological issues that may be involved making the pain persist (i say this because in my own case the pain oddly got better after i realized i had an option to remove the mesh – i have a theory about this and it relates to something commonly called Tension Myositis Syndrome, or Mindbody Syndrome). or as Good Intentions stated there may be physical reasons. or some combination of both.

[ajm222]

quote Meshpain:

Hey Everyone,
It has been just over 3 months since I had my mesh removed by Dr. Belyansky and the results really are amazing. There was plenty of pain from the surgery, but the relief from the mesh being removed was immediate upon waking up. He was able to get almost all of the mesh out with no complications and I feel like I have a new lease on life. Right away I no longer needed the cane to get around. Four days post surgery I was able to walk a mile for the first time in many months. Within a month I was able to lie flat again and stop sleeping in a recliner. Now I’m back at the gym regularly and doing physical therapy to work out the last remaining kinks from surgery and my sedentary “mesh lifestyle.” Sure I still have an occasional pain or some mild burning sensations, but they only last a little while and I am completely off the painkillers after being on percocet every day for almost a year. I am so very happy.

Thanks to everyone here in the forums that shared their stories and insights, and offered their support. Without this site, I know my journey would have been much longer and fraught with even greater frustrations.

Guess I’m gonna have to change my screen name now. 🙂

i keep hearing these very encouraging stories. congrats! i have tentatively scheduled a surgery with Dr. B for February and still can’t decide if I will go through with it or not. unlike many of you, i no longer really have much if any pain. just tightness and discomfort that i’m quite certain is directly caused by the mesh. i don’t love the idea of feeling for the rest of my life like my hip was removed and put back on slightly crooked, or feel some discomfort while running or sleeping on my stomach. but i also can go lengthy periods of time where it isn’t totally bugging me. just need to weigh the pros and cons and whether i am ready to deal with several more months of recovery from another surgery and more holes in my abdomen. i really don’t like the fact that i spent almost 2 years in discomfort and mild to moderate pain. i kinda feel like i just want this stuff out.

if you get a chance, can you give us any more detail about whether or not he did any other repairs, or if he simply took the mesh out and expects the scar tissue to hold things? also, i’ve been wondering about the recovery and therapy needed. did he recommend that?

[ajm222]

quote DrBrown:

[USER=”3076″]ChrisKeys89[/USER]
Dear Chris.
The most common causes of pain after mesh hernia repair is
1. shinkage and fibrosis of the mesh
2. scarring of the spermatic cord or the local nerves to the mesh.
3. recurrent hernia.
4. hip problems.
Ask your surgeon to evaluate the above possibilities.
Regards
Bill Brown MD

when you say hip problems, do you mean hip problems directly related to the mesh? just trying understand how that would occur. thanks.

[ajm222]

Thank you!

[ajm222]

quote Arkj93:

Hello everyone and thanks for reading my post.

This Friday, 11/15 I am having my mesh removed by Dr. Belyansky in at Anne Arundel Medical Center in Annapolis, Maryland. Since having my mesh put inside me in May 2018 I have been having problems with chronic pain and foreign body sensation (link to my original post https://www.herniatalk.com/11388-my-mesh-story-and-questions-about-removal). Since then I have visited with my PCP and five surgeons, including the implanting surgeon, and Dr Belyansky. Many doctors seemed dismissive of my case or told me that the pain would disappear with time, but Dr. Belyansky seemed to think that the mesh was the problem after I had finished telling him what I was feeling. When I visited with him in August of this year he ordered a CT scan and when that was returned, he said the mesh was clearly placed around my spermatic cord and would need to be removed, with the genital branch of the genitofemoral nerve as it was likely trapped in the mesh and causing me pain. Thus far my experience with Dr Belyansky has been the best out of all the surgeons I visited with. He has been the most courteous, empathetic and professional doctor I have met with, and has taken the time to listen to my case and give me a clear explanation of what to expect from surgery. Ultimately I am writing this post to give everyone who read my initial post an update, and hopefully writing this will help anyone who is in a similar situation. Of course I am nervous for the upcoming surgery but I feel like I am in good hands, and I would like to thank everyone on this forum for helping me on this journey.

Take care everyone, and wish me luck!

AJ

Keep us posted. I’m considering the same with Dr. B. I’m not in much pain at the moment and mainly it’s a foreign body sensation for me at this stage, so I can’t decide. But he’s definitely the guy to go to. Best of luck. I would definitely be interested in following your recovery process and if you have much improvement.

[ajm222]

quote Julian:

Ajm222…just from my experience and from what I have read…I would avoid an open removal if you can…if your current mesh is in laparoscopically then have it removed the same way..just my opinion

yeah, for sure. i was just curious what dr. brown thought of open versus robotic removal recovery.

[ajm222]

quote DrBrown:

[USER=”2051″]ajm222[/USER]
Dear AJM.
In your situation I often use trigger point injections. For example, if the mesh is injected with a local anesthetic and you feel great for a few hours, that would be strong evidence that removing the mesh will help you. If injecting the mesh does not help then I would perform a nerve block.
Regards.
Bill Brown MD

Another somewhat related question for Dr. Brown. I know you typically do an open repair, while Dr. Belyansky (at least in my case) would do a robotic repair (partially because that’s also how mine was put in). Do you think open removal has a longer recovery time than robotic removal?