Good intentions
Forum Replies Created
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They’re all laparoscopy surgeons. They all seem well-educated, some are teachers. You’ll get the standard mesh implantation from any of them.
https://profiles.stanford.edu/james-korndorffer
profiles.stanford.edu
James R. Korndorffer, Jr. MD, MHPE, FACS's Profile | Stanford Profiles
James R. Korndorffer, Jr. MD, MHPE, FACS is part of Stanford Profiles, official site for faculty, postdocs, students and staff information (Expertise, Bio, Research, Publications, and more). The site facilitates research and collaboration in academic endeavors.
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https://provider.elcaminohealth.org/marc-zare-md-1639286214-1
provider.elcaminohealth.org
Marc Zare, MD | General Surgery | Los Gatos
Dr. Marc Zare is a board-certified surgeon who specializes in advanced laparoscopic surgery. He’s passionate about providing safe, minimally invasive surger
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gastricbypasssanfrancisco.com
John J. Feng, MD specializes in advanced laparoscopic and minimally invasive weight loss, or bariatric surgery. He has dedicated his practice to several methods of bariatric surgery, all of which can be performed laparoscopically. He believes that surgery can be … Continue reading
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Here is a link to your post from 5 weeks ago. Did you try the suggestions?https://herniatalk.com/forums/topic/mesh-removal-3/
herniatalk.com
Mesh Removal - Hernia Discussion - Hernia Talk
Mesh Removal - Hernia Discussion - Hernia Talk
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Hello William. I am no expert on legal issues. But as I read this, the judge has decided that there is enough information available from the previous trials for the two parties to come to a settlement agreement. I think that the judge is making the plaintiffs’ representation decide if they really want to try each case individually, and the defendants decide if they want to take the risk of paying out a large number of individual settlements for each future lost case.
I think that the situation is unusual in that the products are still for sale. So if the device makers decide to take the chance on paying individual cases they are looking at a continuous stream of settlement payments, even past those of the plaintiffs in the class action. Each individual case will set precedent for future cases. On the other hand, the plaintiffs’ lawyers will have a huge amount of work in front of them, recruiting and training lawyers for the individual cases. I’m just guessing, I don’t really know how it would work. But that seems like the game of chicken that is being played.
One interesting aspect of remanding back to the individual’s districts is that each individual case will bring in more and more varied discovery. The surgeons will be involved along with others involved in each procedure. It could get really messy. In one of the cases the device maker’s lawyers tried to blame the surgeon fo “failure to inform”. Many of the plaintiffs probably would not have sued if there wasn’t a class action to join. But now that it is happening it seems more likely that many will continue. They have already retained counsel and started the process. Thousands of people testifying under oath about the failed promises and after the surgery gaslighting, avoidance, and deflection when they had problems.
I think that most class action lawsuits are filed for products that have been removed from market. Like 3M’s defective ear plug suit. The lawsuits are attempts to make the damaged parties whole for past transgressions. But here, the settlement payments will have to be figured in to the future costs of the products, since the same products are still being sold and will have the same ratio of problems. Or the pre-surgery disclosures will be so explicit that people will avoid the products. So far, there seems to be no progress at all on disclosure either. Same products, same disclosures, same stories. No change. Because, I assume, it would show that they knew and did nothing.
I wonder if anyone has considered suing the FDA for their approval of these damaging products and the lack of oversight in recognizing the issues reported in their own database. I could see a jury voting to make the government responsible. They’re not doing their job.
It’s easy to imagine that the class action gets settled but the individual cases continue. What is “supposed to happen” is that the bad products are removed from market after a large class action suit. But I think that the mesh repair money is just too good and that there are probably ways to pass the payment costs on to the public as a whole, through the insurance companies. At the end of the day it’s always about the money.
Pretty fascinating. Thanks for bringing it up again. Maybe somebody with actual law education/experience can explain more.
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Two months of “mediation” talks ahead and probably nothing decided at the end. Meanwhile, no changes by the device makers. I am seeing more mentions of Phasix though. The absorbale mesh.
“<b style=”background-color: var(–bb-content-background-color); font-family: inherit; font-size: inherit; color: var(–bb-body-text-color);”>March 25, 2024 Update
The first day of the mediation was today. There is no news. There may be news tomorrow. The most realistic good news would be another scheduled mediation and a report of progress.
March 5, 2024 Update
Judge Sargus has issued an order outlining a mediation plan and schedule aimed at facilitating a settlement in the Bard hernia mesh MDL. The order schedules an in-person mediation session for March 25 and March 26, 2024 (it was originally scheduled earlier in the month). The mediator is John Jackson
If there is no settlement by May 24, 2024, the parties need so submit a plan to advance the litigation. I doubt that will be a joint plan if it comes to it. Let’s just hope these cases can get settled.”
https://www.lawsuit-information-center.com/bard-hernia-mesh-lawsuits.html
lawsuit-information-center.com
Hernia Mesh Lawsuit Against C.R. Bard
C.R. Bard is defending over 18,000 hernia mesh lawsuits alleging that its mesh devices were defective, resulting in injuries and complications for thousands of hernia surgery patients. Our hernia ...
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I feel compelled to add another comment about doing whatever it takes to remove pressure on the outside of the hernia repair area. Since getting rid of tight waistlines on pants and belts, and using suspenders to hold my pants up instead, I have really been able to get back closer to my old self. More strenuous running and able to to work harder, without needing to rest for a day or two in between. So much so that “taking care of the damaged hernia repair area” is no longer my primary thought to start, and during, the day. I hadn’t realized how much of my thinking time it was occupying until I didn’t need to think about it anymore.
The weather has warmed up and I put on a pair of shorts with a tight waistband and felt the old discomfort creeping back in almost immediately. Trying to be “normal” had really been holding me back. Suspenders have made a huge difference.
Anyway, it’s something to try if you’re having pain or discomfort after a hernia repair or mesh removal.
I will post this separately as an Update since my last post got buried in the thread. It was the last chronologically but it got placed somewhere up above.
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Here is the public one.
https://www.facebook.com/HerniaMeshInjury/
facebook.com
Hernia Mesh Injury Support Group
Hernia Mesh Injury Support Group. 1,534 likes. This group is to provide support to those of have suffered from a Hernia Mesh Injury & to provide new
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You’ve learned quite a bit in just four to five months. Congratulations. What type of truss are you using while weight-lifting? Does it help? What type of hernia?
You didn’t say what type of procedure would be used for the mesh implantation. Progrip is used for many hernia repair procedures, from Lichtenstein to laparoscopic.
What made you narrow your options down to just mesh or Shouldice? And how did you end up on Herniatalk? Just curious.
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That’s a weird one. Two weeks and you’re measuring semen quantity? Seems early to worry…
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I would start here.
https://atriumhealth.org/for-providers/todd-heniford
atriumhealth.org
B. Todd Heniford, MD | Department of Surgery | Atrium Health
B. Todd Heniford, MD, is the founder and chief of the Division of Gastrointestinal and Minimally Invasive Surgery at Atrium Health.
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William, when you create a new Discussion you have to scroll down to the bottom of the page and choose a sub-forum. Even though there is only one choice. If you don’t the forum softwae will give an error message that does not indicate how to fix the problem. “<strong style=”font-family: inherit; font-size: inherit; color: var(–bb-body-text-color);”>ERROR: Forum ID is missing.”
Yes, the forum is still “clunky”, it has not changed much since the early correction of a few problems. I still get the endless “Updating” message on some days. When the News page does show up it often does not show new Discussion replies, that’s why I always add a “What’s on your mind” after I reply to a Discussion. The “News” updates scroll away in to oblivion pretty quickly, so they are kind of like Tweets, only seen for a very short time.
But it is still a good place to collect some thoughts and report some things like you just did. Who knows, it might eventually start working like a normal forum someday. Just keep hoping.
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Read through old posts on the forum. You’ve probably seen them already.
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Who have you contacted so far? Many people have had mesh removed in other parts of the country. The experiences are all about the same. The mesh is removed, pain is diminshed, healing and recovery takes a long time.
A plug would most likley be removed via an open procedure. Dr. Towfigh has posted on Twitter about plugs.
https://twitter.com/Herniadoc/status/1021561699290116097
What do you see?
— Dr. Shirin Towfigh (@Herniadoc) July 24, 2018
This is a medium size Perfix #plug #mesh that has balled up, aka #meshoma . It was causing chronic groin & nerve #pain due to erosion into the spermatic cord, so I excised it. He is now #pain free!🙏🏻#meshcomplication #hernia #chronicpain #itsnotjustahernia pic.twitter.com/EgnLh0ULXR -
The type of surgery for the mesh implantation is very important. Lichtenstein is an open surgery. The piece of mesh is smaller but it is in front of the abdominal wall, rather than behind like in a laparoscopic implantation.
The situation you describe is very typical. Each surgeon learns a specific method and that is what they do for the rest of their career, in most cases. They are insulated from the long-term results of their work by the bureaucracy and lack of interest or even avoidance by the corporations they work for. Get second, third and fourth opinions, with details of their procedure and the material used, and you will probably get second, third and fourth variations for the same hernia. The only consistency is the chance of chronic pain and problems.
The scientific publications that describe efforts to quantify the mesh chronic pain problem consistently come up with about a one in six chance of chronic pain or discomfort of some kind after a mesh implantation. Some researchers find much higher numbers, others find lower. But the 15% number just keeps coming up. It’s kind of shocking how common it is and how it is just accepted as “normal”. One of the major lawsuits today is based on the “failure to inform” the patient, by the corporations or individual surgeons, of the much higher possibility of problems than the typical pre-surgery pamphlet shows.
https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/procedures/17967-hernia-repair-surgery
“What are the risks or complications?
As with all surgeries, hernia surgery has some risks. Some you’re more likely to experience shortly after surgery. Others typically show up in the long term.
…
(Last words, way down at the bottom. No quantifying, no description. Vague words. And this is from one of the preeminent hernia repair clinics in the States. They even have a separate pain clinic to address problems after the fact. But no clear warning before.)
Some people experience long-term pain after surgery. Pain that lasts longer than three months is called post-herniorrhaphy neuralgia. If you’re diagnosed with this condition, you may need medications or surgery.”
my.clevelandclinic.org
If your hernia is causing unpleasant symptoms like pain or pressure, it may be time for surgery to fix it. Here’s what to expect.
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Not sure how the talc suit link got in there. Here”s the Hernia Mesh link –
https://www.lawsuit-information-center.com/bard-hernia-mesh-lawsuits.html
lawsuit-information-center.com
Hernia Mesh Lawsuit Against C.R. Bard
C.R. Bard is defending over 18,000 hernia mesh lawsuits alleging that its mesh devices were defective, resulting in injuries and complications for thousands of hernia surgery patients. Our hernia ...
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I’m replying to sensei_305’s last post so that it will show up at the bottom of the thread.
A month or two ago I shared some ideas about ways to avoid pain at the site of past surgeries. The use of suspenders has worked so well that I have now created new sore areas, but of a more moderate type and not really hindering my activities. Overall, now the whole area of past mesh contact seems to feel kind of like what happens when you try to uncrinkle a balled up piece of tape. As one area relaxes another area takes up the stress. Sometimes some soreness on one side, sometimes another, often over the areas of the internal rings, sometimes the spermatic cords. But, nothing that makes me feel like I might be having a recurrence and/or should stop doing what I want to do.
I guess the main message for anybody struggling to recover from surgery, of any type, is to make the changes that make you feel right. I really should not be wearing suspenders, and they are a bother to install on my various pants, and to wear throughout the day, and to wonder about how to explain them if somebody sees them under my clothes. I’m basically living a hidden life. But the benefits of feeling healthy and strong again far outweigh the weirdness of it all.
Good luck to everyone. It’s a shame that the forum activity has disappeared.
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I had been posting about changing my clothes to reduce all external pressure on the areas that were involved in my original hernia and mesh repair/removal. I ended up with suspenders. They have made a big difference. So much so that, as is common with a person who used to be very athletic, I have been trying to expand my physical range. More/harder exercise, longer walks/hikes/runs, etc. Now that the localized right side pain is reduced, I’ve worked up to a broader, lower level of soreness.
I feel much better, but I’ve realized that the areas that the mesh was in contact with, or the areas involved in the dissection process, to create the space for the mesh, were really ravaged by the whole implantation repair process, and will probably never really recover. My lower abodmen, from hip-bone to hip-bone, and navel to pubic bone, is really messed up. Sometimes I still wonder in amazement about how I got in to this situation. It really is incredible. It’s been almost ten years since I trusted my surgeon to “fix” me and let me get back to my very healthy and active life. Instead I feel like I’ve been in some sort of horrible accident.
Anyway, it’s a long road back and I can’t imagine that I will ever get back to where I was before. My gut is still distorted, my clothes still don’t fit right, and I still get sore after extended sessions of physical activity, although things are still getting better. But I’ll probably spend the rest of my life “taking care of” my gut.
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Delay, delay, delay.
From one of the links above.
“March 5, 2024 Update
Judge Sargus has issued an order outlining a mediation plan and schedule aimed at facilitating a settlement in the Bard hernia mesh MDL. The order schedules an in-person mediation session for March 25 and March 26, 2024 (it was originally scheduled earlier in the month). The mediator is John Jackson
If there is no settlement by May 24, 2024, the parties need so submit a plan to advance the litigation. I doubt that will be a joint plan if it comes to it. Let’s just hope these cases can get settled.
March 3, 2024 Update
There are now 21,262 filed hernia mesh lawsuits in the MDL. In terms of truly active MDLs, it ranks second only to the talc powder litigation.
February 20, 2024 Update
So the next big shot at settlement is next month. As expected, the MDL judge issued CMO #51 creating a new settlement mediation process for the litigation hernia mesh litigation.
The game plan is an person session set for March 4 and 5, 2024, with the possibility of additional meetings at the mediator’s discretion. (This has since been postponed. See the March 5th update above.)
Parties involved in the mediation must notify the court by May 24, 2024, if an impasse occurs, with a joint proposal for moving the litigation forward due by June 24, 2024. I’m assuming this means – because it has to mean – shipping these cases back to their local federal court and getting trials going.
The mediation will involve key representatives from both the plaintiffs and defendants, including a court-appointed mediator, John Jackson, and members of the Plaintiffs’ Negotiation Committee, alongside representatives with negotiating authority from the defendants’ side.
February 5, 2024 Update
CMO #50 came out on Friday, a new order that deals with two main issues: whether to let the Byran case go to trial – the fourth bellwether – and how to manage and possibly send back (remand) Bard hernia mesh lawsuits to their original courts for further proceedings.
Let’s break it down in this litigation that will never seem to end:
On Holding a Fourth Bellwether Trial
The court decided not to hold a fourth bellwether trial. The judge believes that after three trials, and considering the costs and time spent, another trial wouldn’t add much value. The cases already tried involved different legal points and devices, and another trial on a different device wouldn’t change the fundamental issues. Is this really true? The 3M earplug litigation had 16 trials. Indeed, a 5th endpoint would not be counterproductive and would keep the parties under pressure.
But I don’t get to make that call. The court feels it has learned enough from the previous trials and that trying a new case wouldn’t significantly change the understanding of the issues at hand.
The Bryan case was falling apart for the defendants because the treating doctor did not help the warnings case. So, on some level, this is a relief. But having no trial scheduled is just a path to more wheel spinning.
The Future Management and Structure of Potential Remand of Cases
The plaintiffs’ lawyers are fine with remand and want an order on how the remaining cases should be managed and sent back to the courts they came from for trial.
The court denied this request, calling it premature and unreasonable. The court had hoped for a global settlement (an agreement to resolve all cases) before considering mass remanding cases. The proposal was seen as favoring plaintiffs unduly by demanding very fast-paced discovery (the process of gathering evidence) and trials, which the court found unrealistic.
But trial dates create the pressure to settle in the first place. This litigation has been going on forever, and now the cases are supposed to be settled without the pressure of trials? The judge in this case has really done an excellent job administering this litigation. But this feels like the path to nowhere. I would love to be wrong..”
lawsuit-information-center.com
Talc Powder Ovarian Cancer Lawsuit
Our lawyers are handling baby powder lawsuits in all 50 states. The talcum powder lawsuits against Johnson & Johnson have been ongoing for years. The lawsuits allege that prolonged use of ...
