Good intentions
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quote Luke7:It’s never felt quite right but I figured there would be some residual pain so that is life..Almost exactly a year later, while at work I noticed my right testicle swelling back up and soreness where the mesh had been installed.
I finally saw a surgeon that was not willing to accept that these two could be related and ordered an MRI. Now, the results from the MRI actually show that I DON’T have a new hernia… Now I’m totally confused.
I have been dealing with this for almost two months now, out of work, in pain that is consistent with an inguinal hernia. My pelvic is sore to touch and I get shooting pains all the time. My right testicle is tender, and the inflammation of my epididymis does fluctuate but is constant.
I feel like there is a complication with the mesh that was installed and it’s causing inflammation and continuous pain. What’s extremely frustrating is that all this could have been avoided if the doctor had not installed mesh where there was no actual hernia.
I met with a Hernia Specialist recently and she referred me to a pain clinic and if they can’t help then she said surgery might be an option
I’m really trying not to write a book here and just keep it concise. Based on what I’ve written so far, does it sound like I got botched or is this just a typical complication? All of this just really doesn’t seem right to me…
Thank you for any help or advice in advance,
Were you working/functioning at the same level when the pain reappeared or did you exert yourself before it happened.? Mesh has been known to tear free and cause new pain. Do you know what type of mesh was used for the repair? There are many different types and sizes and some have more complications than others. It;s important to now exactly what the first guy used, how much, and his method of implantation, if you can. The records should be available.
Hernia repair is now a business, not so much a passion for healing. Your first surgeon was sold a type of mesh by a device maker’s rep and trained in how to use it and told that it is harmless. He didn’t know. Your second surgeon is following what seems to be the new “thing”, sending people off to pain management to try to save the mash before recommending mesh removal. You’re in the mesh repair “system” protocol now. This new protocol could actually have long-term value if the results are collected and shared. Certain types of mesh probably have common problems.
Is your second surgeon an actual hernia repair expert or does she just work at a hernia repair center? Make sure that you find a surgeon with years of experience and an objective view about what your problem is. There are many surgeons today who made it through medical school and residency and learned the minimum necessary to get the mesh in, but might not really be well-versed in all of the potential problems it causes.
Good luck. Keep searching for the right doctor. There aren’t very many.
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You really need to get all of the details of your surgery. There are many many different things that a surgeon can do while they are doing “TEP mesh placement”. Neurectomies, tacks, size of mesh, where it’s placed, etc. They all do different things while they’re in there. “TEP” is a very vague acronym and only describes the procedure in very general terms.
Get the notes from your surgery, don’t rely on what you remember your surgeon telling you. Good luck.
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quote Julian:.I had open left hernia repair in 2017..that mesh migrated..meshoma occured..it ended up wrapping around my spermatic cord. Had sexual dysfunction. Both side of groin went numb….
march of 2019 I had mesh removed and surgeon put in another mesh in laproscopticlly tep…
.surgeon ordered a Pelvic MRI .
he said the mesh is flat and is in correct location but I’m living in hell right now…is removing this progrip mesh an option at this point cause it has to be playing a part in my pain and problems…I’ve been to neurosurgeon…neurologist
been to so many doctors and they cant find an explanation to my problems…Did the surgeon “examine” the other side during the TEP procedure? TEP creates a very big space, peeling open a large void as the balloon expands. Even if no mesh is placed on the other side the tissue has still been peeled apart and has to heal. Others have reported after-effects from TEP explorations even though no hernia was found and no mesh was placed. It is a very invasive procedure, on the inside. Tiny holes on the outside, large areas of tissue torn apart on the inside. TEP is probably the most invasive the minimally invasive techniques. It’s not really minimally invasive, that is a marketing term.
You might try to consult with Dr. Beltyansky or Dr. Billing. Get the details of your TEP procedure first though. You want to know how much mesh was placed and if the other side was examined.
I had similar tightening and loss of sensation after my bilateral TEP placement of Bard Soft Mesh.
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Hello Amemon. I see that your surgery was 6 weeks ago. What have you been doing, physically, since the surgery?
One thing that I have found since my mesh removal surgery, especially in the early weeks/months afterward, is that sometimes more activity is better than more rest, for resolving pain. My thought is that the areas that have been damaged during surgery need the movement provided by physical activity to allow fluids to move and be replaced and for nerves and vessels to grow back in. There were days where I rested and waited for specific pain to resolve but it didn’t. So I would go out for a rigorous run or hike, and it worked.
I found that activities that caused heavy breathing seemed to help a lot. Hiking in hilly terrain, biking, or similar. It can’t hurt to try it, I would assume
Good luck.
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Also, my problems were very general, not problems that could be solved by cutting nerves. I would be leary of any neurectomies that are assumed to be generally necessary. Broad problems can’t be fixed by neurectomy. I think that Dr. Billing just removes the mesh and leaves as much as possible behind. The mesh is the cause, not the nerves.
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Hello ajm22. All of my bodily functions have improved and become more normal since I had the mesh removed. As I’ve mentioned in other posts it’s been a slow process. but constant improvement. I was just realizing yesterday as I took a long walk/hike around a nice city that the mesh had really “calloused:” the tissue it had been in contact with. My abdominal wall is still stiff overall but getting softer and more normal over the weeks, months and years. Dr. Belyanski’s comment about a “scar plate” fit what I’ve been experiencing. I think that the plate forms wherever the mesh was, and is a reason for so many problems. The surgeons who implant don’t think about how the scar plate effects thing in the long-term.
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I found that I had effects from mesh that could not be explained directly by defining specific nerves or vessels being affected. There was no question for me though that the mesh caused the problem. After the mesh was removed the effects resolved and I was back to normal. I think that there is a thought process that assumes that only tissue in direct contact with an inflammatory agent will be affected. But I think that the body might react more generally and cause unexplained side-effects.
As far as mesh removal, you have a complex hernia repair system, designed to be permanent. The damage from removal will probably take some time to recover from. Dr. Brown has a long history of working with athletes, he was on my very short list of potential mesh removal surgeons. I chose Dr. Peter Billing though because he does laparoscopic removal. Good luck.
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quote saro:it is recommended to me because I have waited too long and my hernia can only be contained with a mesh or with non-absorbable sutures
the latter are never absorbed, while the biological one takes a year
good question huh?I would not conflate the cause of all of the hernia repair problems down to the use of synthetic material in the body. The rise of the long-term hernia mesh problems seems to follow the rise in coverage of larger internal areas with mesh, and with the laparosocpy used to do so. Those three things have grown together over the years. Mesh problems, mesh area coverage, laparsocopy. The dissection of large areas to implant absorbable mesh might have similar problems to synthetic mesh, just due to the exposure of so much area to place the mesh. Without proper long-term studies, everyone is just trying new “stuff” and hoping.
Ask the person proposing the use of the absorbable mesh why they think it’s better and what proof that they can show you that it is better, compared to other options. Don’t take short-term results as worth much. If they refer back to device maker data, be very suspect. The device makers are selling product, not curing patients. The faster that they get to market the more money they make.
Good luck. Get second and third opinions, even if you respect the first surgeon’s work.
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Good luck Forest, After the absorbale portion is absorbed you”ll have a common polymer fiber-based mesh. The same long-term odds as everyone else I think. Short-term might look better but long-term, there’s no reason to expect a difference.
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[USER=”2580″]DrBrown[/USER] second try
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As I understand things mesh would not be an option for a 12 yr old. But it would not be a surprise to see the device makers trying to get more market share. Don’t let anyone use mesh, he’s too young.
[USER=”935″]drtowfigh[/USER]
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quote Ericajane1987:I have been in a hospital bed and laid flat for 9 days as every time I move it starts the pain. The dr said it’s unexplainable. .
I think that you need to work hard to get another doctor. Sometimes people get so focused on solving a problem themselves that they forget the real reason that they are there. Your doctor should be seeking help himself if he does not know what is happening. The fact that he’s not, while you suffer, suggests that he has lost touch with the oath that he took.
Ask your nurses if they know of a doctor who might be able to help. Nurses see everything that happens over the years and often know how to get things done. They might not be able to answer directly though so listen for hints.
God luck.
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That is terrible Dr. Brown. Can you give more details on the type of mesh, the type of repair, and how long the patient suffered with it? Also, how soon after the first repair did they start to feel pain? How long did it take for those vessels to become trapped?
Many people wonder how long that they should wait before considering removal.
[USER=”2580″]DrBrown[/USER]
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What type of surgery did you have? Laparoscopy is used for many procedures.
If “the doctor’ is the one that did the surgery, he or she might be avoiding the possibility that they made a mistake. Find a new doctor for a second opinion. There is nothing at all wrong with asking for a second opinion, it actually takes the pressure off of the first doctor. You do not owe the doctor loyalty.
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At four days the mesh is basically just sitting in a bath of weak tissue and fluids. There is probably minor movement of the tissues and the mesh when you move.
Can you give some details of the procedure and the type of mesh that was used? Is it the same as your first procedure and did you go to the same surgeon?
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quote B_Rebovich12:I was wondering if it is standard protocol to have an umbilical hernia containing bowel fixed?
I lead a very active lifestyle and intend to resume my typical workout routines, which involve lifting and lots of interval training and running.
I don’t want to have to worry about this getting larger or causing issues with bowel strangulation. Is that something that you have to worry about with these types?next: I would intend to have both situations remedied at one time.
Would it be best to pursue a general surgeon vs. a gynecologist for this?
Are there physicians who specialize in both types of repair?Take your time and find a verified hernia specialist with a history of working on athletic people, with verifiable success. Make sure that they have a history of successful repairs, not just a web site that says they are a specialist. Whatever you do, do not just accept what the medical system provides at the first referral. There is a “lowest common denominator” approach to hernia repair, with a high risk of ruining your body for athletic activity. It involves maximum mesh coverage, designed to keep you alive and avoid future recurrences, but with little consideration for actual long-term physical, mental, and emotional quality of life.
As a strong healthy active person you will be tempted to think that you can “power through” whatever happens, just work harder until you’re healed, but with mesh problems the harder you try the worse things get. Read through old Topics on the forum, there are many from athletic people who can no longer do the things that they were assured they would be able to do. Nothing has changed over the last few years, the mesh revolution is still growing and being locked in by standardization of methods. Make sure that you get it right from the very beginning.
If you just take your primary physicians first referral, it is almost sure that you will get a mesh repair, possibly from a newly produced surgeon who only knows mesh implantation, with all of its known risks. Choose the physician you want and do whatever it takes to get them.
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Sorry to sound so “not positive” Pericles. Really though, it’s too soon since your surgery to know what’s what. At four days there is most likely still lots of extra fluid around the surgery site that needs to be removed by your body. But getting your surgery notes while you wait is worth doing.
Good luck. [USER=”2993″]Pericles[/USER]
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Change – The details of your surgery might help. There are two main forms of laparoscopy, TEP and TAPP, and many different types of mesh, plus the two main types of hernia, direct or indirect. The surgery notes should describe what the surgeon found and what they did.
Generally though, the mesh, of whatever brand or type, is just placed over the hernia area, with much extra material extending well beyond the area of the hernia itself. The stretched out hole is almost always left alone. This extra mesh material will shrink over time as your body tries to heal. The mesh itself is pretty strong and very unlikely to burst or tear. The swelling that you feel could be fluids that have accumulated in the stretched pocket left by the hernia contents after they were pulled back in to the abdominal cavity. There is no way to predict the results of any individual’s surgery, because no data is collected for all of the different possible combinations, so no correlations of good or bad can be made. Surgeons themselves, most of them, have little idea of how their patients do beyond a few weeks after surgery.
Staying mobile during the first few weeks seems to give good results. It will move the fluids around in the dissected area so that new tissue can grow in to the mesh. The dissection process, the peeling open of the cavity in which to place the mesh, is the main damage that your body is trying to heal. All you can do for the first few weeks is hope, the average surgeon will tell you to wait and see what happens.
Good luck. Keep walking and moving around, don’t do anything strenuous. Things might turn out okay for you. But, unless a hernia recurrence is found, there is no standard course of action to make you feel better. If the mesh looked “right” as they closed you up they aren’t going to do anything for weeks or months. Don’t expect a response from your surgeon that involves more surgery, it’s very unlikely.