Good intentions
Forum Replies Created
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The next trial is really interesting. It involves a very popular mesh, Bard 3D Max, that is used in laparoscopic and robotic procedures. Very mainstream modern hernia repair, the type to where the societies and technology companies are trying to push the hernia repair field. It could have big impact. It looks like they’re focusing on the “3D” nature of the product and its tendency to fold. Although the flat meshes fold also. The focus on manufacturing though, essentially gives an “out” for Bard (now BD) for seling future product. They should focus on the verifiable facts and the harm done. Don’t dilute the argument..
“November 13, 2023: More Bellwether Trials Set
What is next in the hernia mesh lawsuits? Another trial. Scheduled for January 2024, the fourth/fifth bellwether trial involving Bard centers on plaintiff Jacob Bryan, who underwent a surgical procedure involving the use of a 3DMax hernia mesh for inguinal/groin hernia repair. Post-surgery, Mr. Bryan experienced severe complications, including mesh deformation and chronic pain, which have necessitated ongoing medical treatment and may lead to additional surgery.
Originally selected as a bellwether trial by the defendants years ago, there was an effort by them to remove Mr. Bryan’s trial date. Their argument centered on the premise that Mr. Bryan’s complications were more severe than initially expected, potentially skewing the representative nature of the bellwether trial. However, the motion to replace Mr. Bryan as a bellwether case was denied by the Judge Sargus.
The product at the center of this case, the 3DMax hernia mesh, is subject to similar allegations as other products in similar lawsuits. The plaintiff accuses Bard of failing to adequately warn both patients and healthcare providers about the significant risks and potential complications associated with the use of the 3DMax mesh. This includes not just an omission of known risks but also underrepresentation of the severity and frequency of possible adverse effects. Additionally, the lawsuit raises issues regarding the design and manufacturing of the 3DMax mesh. It is alleged that defects in the design and manufacturing process contributed to the complications suffered by patients like Mr. Bryan.”
https://www.millerandzois.com/products-liability/hernia-mesh-case-value/
millerandzois.com
Hernia Mesh Lawsuit Settlement Compensation Payouts
Our hernia mesh lawyers seek new clients suffering severe side effects from these defective products. Over 20,000 hernia mesh lawsuits have been filed. Three hernia mesh device lawsuits have gone ...
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Here is an image showing May bracketing November.
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I just stumbled across this old post by Pinto and wondered if Dr. Jacob has had his hernia repaired yet. 3+ years have passed.
Here is a link to the video.
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Not sure what’s happening, the software showed my double post as being at the end of the thread then moved it up a few again. Anyway, if this is at the end, scroll up a few posts and check the date. Good luck people.
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This will be a double reply. I used the red “Reply” button at the upper right and the software stuck my reply in to the middle of the stream. I assume, maybe, wherever my cursor was.
Hopefully this one shows up at the end of the thread where it can be found, as I thought it would.
Might as well give the forum software some more testing. It is now almost six years since I had mesh removed by Dr. Billing of Transform Weight Loss in Kirkland Washington. Things have been going very well, My range and duration of activities is still slowly expanding. I don’t really have any “down” days anymore, every day is open to spontaneous possibilities. Lifting heavy weights, walking long distances, running, sprinting. I do still get some soreness at the spot of the original hernia, but it feels like it is generated from the outside now. From slight constant external pressure on the spot.
So, as I’ve said before, I don’t want to make anyone feel bad about the long time it might take to get back to full fitness, six years is a long time. But I’d also like to give some hope to people that expected faster results from their surgery, whether it was mesh removal or hernia repair, if recovery is slow for them If you’re feeling progress it will probably continue.
But, also, to be clear, as far as mesh repair surgery, I was making zero progress of recovering from the original best practice top level best surgeon standard of care of TEP implantation of Bard lightweight Soft Mesh. My first ever surgery of any kind was a disaster that lasted three years plus the years after to heal from mesh removal So if you’re having mesh problems don’t let this account convince you to wait too long. You’ll know if things have any chance of getting better.
Also, finally, and maybe most importantly, Dr. Billing really does seem to know what he’s doing “in there”. If you’ve watched any videos of surgeons narrating what they’re doing and/or heard them describe it, there are all sorts of different ways that surgeons do things. There is no standard practice mesh removal method. As far as I know and according to his surgery notes, all that he did was carefully remove as much mesh as he could. No neurectomies were noted as having been done and I do not have any symptoms of neurectomy. No numbness or phantom pain. And no signs of recurrence.
So I can sincerely recommend seeking out Dr. Billing if you feel that you need to have mesh removed.
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Double post. The software placed my reply in the middle of the thread. I copied it to the end.
Might as well give the forum software some more testing. It is now almost six years since I had mesh removed by Dr. Billing of Transform Weight Loss in Kirkland Washington. Things have been going very well, My range and duration of activities is still slowly expanding. I don’t really have any “down” days anymore, every day is open to spontaneous possibilities. Lifting heavy weights, walking long distances, running, sprinting. I do still get some soreness at the spot of the original hernia, but it feels like it is generated from the outside now. From slight constant external pressure on the spot.
So, as I’ve said before, I don’t want to make anyone feel bad about the long time it might take to get back to full fitness, six years is a long time. But I’d also like to give some hope to people that expected faster results from their surgery, whether it was mesh removal or hernia repair, if recovery is slow for them If you’re feeling progress it will probably continue.
But, also, to be clear, as far as mesh repair surgery, I was making zero progress of recovering from the original best practice top level best surgeon standard of care of TEP implantation of Bard lightweight Soft Mesh. My first ever surgery of any kind was a disaster that lasted three years plus the years after to heal from mesh removal So if you’re having mesh problems don’t let this account convince you to wait too long. You’ll know if things have any chance of getting better.
Also, finally, and maybe most importantly, Dr. Billing really does seem to know what he’s doing “in there”. If you’ve watched any videos of surgeons narrating what they’re doing and/or heard them describe it, there are all sorts of different ways that surgeons do things. There is no standard practice mesh removal method. As far as I know and according to his surgery notes, all that he did was carefully remove as much mesh as he could. No neurectomies were noted as having been done and I do not have any symptoms of neurectomy. No numbness or phantom pain. And no signs of recurrence.
So I can sincerely recommend seeking out Dr. Billing if you feel that you need to have mesh removed.
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Hello Carmen. I am on a full-size computer, running Windows and a Chrome browser. I cleared the cache and history completely, every box checked, on my computer and there is still no button visible to start a new Discussion, and the “You cannot…” notification is still there. Here is an image.
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I have found the Discussion page. And used Search to find my old thread. Search on the “News Feed” page does not search the Discussion page. That explains my previous problem.
@dev (Sorry to be so demanding. Discussing the hernia repair situation is a form of catharsis for me, and HerniaTalk is a big part of it).
I have found some documents that describe the complete path to the current state of Per-Fix plug case. Pretty interesting. You can see who used the plug initially, and who removed it then used a different type of mesh to repair the defect.
“<b style=”background-color: var(–bb-content-background-color); font-family: inherit; font-size: inherit; color: var(–bb-body-text-color);”>November 3, 2023 Update
We are still in the defense case in Stinson. Dr. Radke, the explanting surgeon, testified by videotape yesterday.”
Here is a recent document regarding the case, with a summary.
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The Stinson case is progressing along. This latest post makes it seem like a “reasonable” settlement is expected.
Another surgeon has been introduced to the saga. This is from the Miller and Zois link above.
Dr. Badylak is associated with a biotech company, Triad Life Sciences, Inc. https://innovamatrix.com/
Also a professor of surgery. Interesting that he is used by Bard for defense. It would be really interesting to see actual transcripts of trial testimony.
https://www.surgery.pitt.edu/people/stephen-badylak-dvm-phd-md
“November 8, 2023: On Day 14 of the Stinson bellwether hernia mesh trial, Bard called brought Dr. Stephen Badylak to the stand, a witness with a history of testifying for Bard in similar cases. In a move reflective of the parties confidence in a favorable outcome, both sides have jointly filed a motion advocating for the use of a single damages’ verdict form, a measure in accordance with Maine law. This is intended to minimize confusion among jurors and reduce the risk of potential appeals or retrials due to the issue of multiple recoveries for a single harm.”
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That is a very interesting article William, thanks for posting it. I see another familiar name, Dr. Rosen of the Cleveland Clinic, is quoted in it too. He’s one of the good guys.
What I got from the article was not so much that surgeons were learning incorrect techniques via YouTube but that the technology companies facilitated it. They didn’t care that it was wrong they just wanted to get people buying and using their equipment. Like paying to have a training center built on a public university campus. Whatever it takes to get that revenue. Patient health is secondary. It’s just the world we live in today.
I pulled a bunch of pieces from it for anybody who doesn’t want to click through. It’s pretty incredible. Worth reading the whole thing but it won’t make anybody more comfortable about any future surgery.
“Over the next 15 years, the number of times that doctors billed Medicare for a hernia component separation increased more than tenfold, to around 8,000 per year. And that figure is a fraction of the actual number, researchers said, because most hernia patients are too young to be covered by Medicare.”
” “It’s unbelievable,” Rosen said. “I’m watching reasonably healthy people with a routine problem get a complicated procedure that turns it into a devastating problem.” ”
“Component separation must be practiced dozens of times to master it, experts said. But 1 out of 4 surgeons said they taught themselves how to perform the operation by watching Facebook and YouTube videos, according to a recent survey.”
“One instructional video, paid for by another major medical device company, showed a surgeon slicing through the wrong part of the muscle with the da Vinci.
Peper Long, a spokesperson for Intuitive, said the company hired “experienced surgeons” to lead its training courses. “The rise in robotic-assisted hernia procedures reflects the clinical benefits that the technology can offer,” she said.”
“In interviews with the Times, more than a dozen hernia surgeons pointed to another reason for the surging use of component separations: They earn doctors and hospitals more money. Medicare pays at least $2,450 for a component separation, compared with $345 for a simpler hernia repair. Private insurers, which cover a significant portion of hernia surgeries, typically pay two or three times what Medicare does.”
“Intrigued by the hype, Dickens taught himself component separation by watching online videos. His first operation went well, he recalled, but a later patient developed a serious complication, necessitating an additional surgery.
Then, at a dinner meeting in Houston, he presented a video of one of his own surgeries to a group of about 50 other doctors, Dickens recalled. A more experienced surgeon interrupted to say he was operating on the wrong part of the muscle. The rebuke felt like a “red flag,” he said, and he stopped doing the procedure, although he is still a proponent of the da Vinci for other operations.
In June 2021, W.L. Gore & Associates, a medical device company that makes surgical mesh used in hernia repairs, posted a video tutorial on its website. It promised to be a step-by-step guide to component separation surgery.
A surgeon narrated as he cut the patient’s abdominal muscles, releasing tissue so he could close a hernia. But he was operating in the wrong place and likely created a new hernia, according to four surgeons who reviewed the video.
“It absolutely trashed the abdominal wall,” said Jeffrey Blatnik, who directs the Washington University Hernia Center. “It was so offensive to the point that we reached out to the company and told them, ‘You guys need to take this down.’”
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Did you guys see the picture in the publication, of the hernia? The hernia that the guy was “comfortable” with for five years was huge. You can see how the person running the scanner might have questions. It’s interesting how different cultures have different values. I can’t imagine anybody I know living with a hernia that large.
I don’t know that the relatively small hernias discussed on this forum would show up on an airport scanner.
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Follow to the post above – Dr. Grischkan is an expert witness in the case.
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October 31, 2023: Plaintiff rested his case yesterday.October 27, 2023: We said Dr. Grischkan was a key witness. All day yesterday was spend on his continued testimony.
October 26, 2023: Today is Day 9 of the Stinson trial. Yesterday, the plaintiff and David Grischkan provided testiomony. Dr. Grischkan is a board certified general surgeon who specializes in the repair of abdominal wall and inguinal hernias. He is a key plaintiff’s expert on specific causation.
Let’s take a second and recap the allegation in Stinson. The main argument from the Plaintiff is that Bard was aware of the risks associated with its PerFix Plug device but still promoted and sold it without properly warning doctors and patients.
What was the problem? Plaintiff design defect claim contends that the PerFix Plug breaks down after being implanted, leading to a prolonged inflammatory reaction in the body. So instead of putting a warning on the product giving doctors the information they need to do a risk/benefit analysis, Bard minimized the potential complications of the device, patients at an undue risk of severe and lasting harm.
Plaintiff’s lawyers also argue that this inflammatory reaction is exacerbated by poor design choices in the device’s shape, weight, and the size of its pores.
October 17, 2023: The size of the Bard hernia mesh MDL actually decreased over the last month from 20,405 to 20,369 pending cases. This is the first time ever that this class action MDL has posted a monthly decrease in pending cases. What does this mean? It is difficult to say until we see if the trend continues, but this could be a sign that we are running out of possible plaintiffs.
…”https://www.millerandzois.com/products-liability/hernia-mesh-case-value/
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It appears that BD (Bard) is going to fight these cases all the way to judgment or settlement. The lawyers assumed that they would settle but it looks like they’re taking it to court. Weird how the decision coincides with the release of the Updated Guidelines which recommend mesh for the majority of patients. Just odd.
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October 31, 2023 Update
The plaintiff concluded his case yesterday. The defendant began their defense, calling BJ J Pomerants, MD, who testifies that the plaintiff’s pre-implant injuries and conditions “affected the manner in which he perceives pain in his groin both before and after the implant surgery.” This is Bard’s classic defense of looking for someone or something to blame other than its product.October 26, 2023 Update
Our prediction that Bard would come to its senses and settle Stinson did not come to pass. We are now in Day 9 of trial and we can expect the plaintiff to close his case this week.What are the facts in Stinson? The plaintiff had a right inguinal hernia repair using the Extra-Large PerFix Plug mesh made by the Defendants.
Two years later, due to persistent pain in his right groin, Plaintiff had another surgery to see if the hernia had returned or if there was nerve damage.
During this surgery, his doctor discovered a significant amount of scarring and found a “large ball” about 2.5 cm in diameter of mesh that had bundled up next to a specific bone area. Removing this mesh was challenging for his surgeon due to the extensive scarring. After removing it, her used another Bard product – the Bard Marlex Mesh – to fix the hernia.
October 2, 2023 Update
September was a very slow month for the CR Bard hernia mesh MDL docket. The only entry on the docket for the entire month was an Order from the MDL Judge giving the parties seven additional days to resolve a discovery dispute before the Court got involved. Meanwhile, the upcoming bellwether test trial appears to still be one for October 16th, however, and there has been a flurry of pretrial motions filed in that case.
…”https://www.lawsuit-information-center.com/bard-hernia-mesh-lawsuits.html
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Surgeons do worry about “billowing” of the mesh in to the hernia if it is large. It is one reason that fixation might be used where otherwise it would not be. The mesh gets pushed in to the hernia before “incorporation” happens. It could also be that the mesh moved before the body tissue infiltrated it.
I assume that Dr. Muschaweck will leave the existing mesh in place and just open you up from the front to do the minimal repair, on top of the posterior mesh. I would take her advice if it was me. She has seen thousands of situations, many with professional athletes, and knows what works. Why would you second-guess her expertise?
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Thanks for following up Herminius. It’s useful to know who is still out there solving these problems. Good to see that Dr. Muschaweck is still active.
I looked up one of your original threads to fill in the story and linked it below. Could you describe how you ended up with what looks like bilateral mesh implantation after suffering what was apparently a common sports injury? Was the surgeon that implanted the mesh a common general surgeon or a member of a hernia repair specialist organization? This urge to use mesh as a fix-all for any type of groin pain seems to be an epidemic.
Also, if you have the time and patience maybe you could describe what Dr. Muschaweck found. You have traveled an interesting path that could be important to any of us that are physically active and trusting the medical community to have the right solution ready for common injuries. In today’s world it’s up to the individual to find the right solution. Ironically, “Dr. Google” is a necessity today.
https://herniatalk.com/forums/topic/last-minute-advice/#post-36549
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Good morning Carmen. @Carmen_Calvo I was able to create a title and write text but I got an error message when I clicked on Post. Here is an image. Progress!
“! Error: Forum ID is missing.”
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Hello @CursedGroin I managed to find your original post using Google search. I’ve seen your conversation with Herminius and was trying to go back to see what his original symptoms and procedures were and came across your thread instead. If I find it I’ll reply to it and see if it comes back to life.
Alos posting here just to see if I get updates or can follow along with a discussion. The HerniaTalk forum is in bad shape right now, I hope that somebody finds a solution. It might be that Dr. Towfigh has grown tired of it and is phasing it out. Who knows.
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Thanks for the story Dave @mrhernia So, so far, two success stories. One for the original Desarda repair, and one for Dr. Conze.
Do you know if the 2008 Desarda was done with permanent sutures or absorbable? I have seen a drift toward absorbable sutures in various methods, but as far I can understand, that’s probably a bad idea. Nothing wrong with permanent if the repair is done correctly, I think.
Good luck.
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Sensei, you’re back. Who did your repair?